Jon Alexander on his new book, Citizens: Why the Key to Fixing Everything Is All of Us

Beatrice Di Caro: From the World Economic Forum, I'm Beatrice Di Caro, and this is the Book Club podcast. In this episode, we're joined by John Alexander, author of the book Citizens: Why the Key to Fixing Everything is All of US. After spending a decade working in advertising, John realised he was spending too much time focussing on the citizen as a consumer and wondered How can we all become better citizens? Since then, he founded the New Citizenship Project, aiming to figure out how to use his skills not just to sell stuff to consumers, but how to involve people in decisions that affect their lives as a citizen. During the pandemic, he saw the citizen story come out. People were helping one another through unprecedented challenges. The book is a result of that time taking real life examples of citizen led projects and provides us with a hopeful potential path for us to forge on. I began by asking him to talk about the book and what inspired him to write it.

Jon Alexander: The reason why I wrote the book is I think we're in a moment where too many of the people in positions of power in our societies are stuck thinking that that we're in a moment of choice between two stories. They think we're in a choice between what I call the consumer story and the subject story and the consumer story. It is the default pattern of our society over the last 30 years. The idea that people are by nature self-interested, that what we have to do is find ways to make that self-interest add up to the collective interest. Consumer story results in or manifests in. The idea is that democracy is elections that people choose between the options that are offered to them and that they do so out of self-interest, that it manifests in governments largely becoming kind of service providers. It manifests in businesses making profit, but often, too often sort of maximising profit. And it results in NGOs and civil society organisations, often sort of having a bit of a corporate inferiority complex. We can come back to a consumer story and it's fraying. But the danger is that we think we're in a choice between the consumer story and the subject story, which is the kind of rising authoritarianism, the kind of strongman leader world, the idea that the right thing for us all to do is to keep our heads down and do as we're told and and do what the God given few who know, who best tell us to do. I see us as in a moment when the consumer story is kind of fraying and falling apart in a lot of ways, and the subject story is raising its head. And therefore, those in positions of power think they're defending the consumer story from the subject's story. And what I'm really trying to do with the book and what I'm trying to say is actually there's a whole other story we could step into what I call the citizen story, which says actually that the right thing to do is to get involved and the right thing for organisations and leaders to do is to seek to invite the ideas and energy and resources of everyone into seeking the best outcomes for society as a whole. I see that as something that is emerging in lots of different ways and places in every aspect, in every sector. And maybe just to complete that sort of first answer, I, I came to the work actually from originally working in the advertising industry at what I would consider maybe the kind of coalface of the consumer story. Right. Like. And my first boss described my job to me by saying what you've got to remember is the average consumer sees something like 3000 commercial messages of the day, and your job is to cut through that. You've got to make yours the best. And I'm a bit of a competitor, so I was happy with that. But then I became started asking, What are we doing to ourselves when we're telling ourselves we're consumers 3000 times a day, when that's the story of the individual in society and came to eventually came to found that organisation called the new citizenship projects, which is really all about trying to take the same sorts of skills but to use them to design participatory process, to involve people in the world, to invite people into their agency as citizens, not to sell them stuff as consumers. And the book is really the result of working with that set of ideas for four, six, seven, eight years and and then going, Oh, I need to share this. This is this is exciting and great. And so many people would what could, could, could maybe benefit from and enjoy working with this in the same way I have.

Beatrice Di Caro: Thank you. It's really fascinating. I think, especially with everything going on right now, it's quite a hopeful message. How do we get people to be part of that citizen story? Do you have examples for our audience of citizen stories around the world, be it in government and business examples of the citizen story?

Jon Alexander: Yeah, absolutely. And across sectors across the world, I'm really fascinated in the sphere of government by what's going on in Paris at the moment. As a now standing citizens assembly, 100 randomly selected Parisian citizens represents eight of the city population, including refugees and migrants. In the calculation, by the way, that is acting as a kind of upper house of the city. So they have a triple remit to to hold the elected council to account to decide the theme for €100 million a year of participatory budgeting and also to commission what are called citizens enquiries into up to four issues a year. Mexico City crowdsource the Constitution for itself relatively recently, a couple of years ago using a similar sort of process. I'm also really fascinated in that sphere by how how President Zelensky is leading Ukraine in Russia's war in Ukraine, that the way that he has explicitly appealed not just to the to the pride and participation of all the citizens of Ukraine, but actually turned out well to the world and invited us into our agency to be part of that, as well as amazing speech right at the beginning of the war where he explicitly turned out and said, I need you, the people of the world, to get accurate information through to the Russian people and and the response that was a huge surge of creativity using TripAdvisor and Google Maps and things to portray accurate information and get it through the censorship. I'm really fascinated by the growing move. Movements for things like equity crowdfunding, which see people actually the customers of a business become the investors in that business and hold those companies to account in very interesting ways. Brewdog As an example, I talk about a bit in the book and how they've been held to account by their 175,000 strong army of what they call equity punks. There's that phenomenon of platform corporatism, I think is very interesting in how kind of competitors and insurgents against sort of rising up to challenge some of the ways of working of the Ubers and Abbi and these of the world and holding them back to their original kind of promise coming from that space. And then in civil society as well, the kind of the reclamation of the idea of movements rather than sort of professionalised organisations doing stuff for people. I'm involved at the moment bringing a lot of these together. We've just launched a campaign in the UK called The People's Plan for Nature, where the biggest nature conservation organisations in the UK are actually collaborating to crowdsource ideas and stories and examples of citizen led practise in nature conservation and then feed those into a citizen's assembly process. A little bit like the Paris model, which will then develop a citizen led citizen generated political policy agenda for the natural environment and then and then challenge government to step into it. These ways of working, I think, are really just fundamentally about they're all united by the fact that they are rooted in the idea that all of us are smarter than any of us, and that actually it's by tapping into the ideas and energy and resources of everyone that we that we get the best results. And I think that, as you say, that is a very hopeful thing at the moment, at a time when hope can feel like it's a little bit recessive. If you see this time as just a we have to defend what we have or slide into authoritarian as you see it as a binary in that way, then it can be easy to fall into quite, quite a dark place.

Beatrice Di Caro: Yeah, of course. I'm fascinated by these examples. Have we seen positive results, for example, from the Paris model with especially the younger generation, there's a lack of of trust that these new types of crowd governments will really bring any change at all. How has the Paris model worked so far?

Jon Alexander: The Paris model specifically is very new, but the OECD actually has been tracking the emergence of this and over the last few years and published a report relatively recently gathering the evidence from over 600 deliberative processes around the world. And what they found was significant evidence that levels of trust in government and levels of trust actually, even more importantly, levels of interpersonal trust and interpersonal trust in the societies involved increase where these processes are present and also the legitimacy of government decision making increases because it's just closer to people. I think the dynamic of our times actually is we talk a lot about people not trusting governments and institutions. Right. And that's true. And it's a problem. But I think that the solution doesn't just lie in saying, let's get people to trust institutions. We have to understand that what happens when people don't trust institutions is they start behaving with more anger. And then the critical thing that happens is the institutions, governments, business, whatever. Start looking at that anger and that rage often. There's a study recently that SPIEGEL did in in Germany that said that 40% of the German population chose the word rage as the best word to describe their emotional state. And in that in that context, what happens is that institutions stop trusting people. And when institutions stop trusting people, they draw power into themselves and put up walls between them and people. And that makes people. Feel less trusting of institutions. It makes people feel pushed away. And then people trust institutions less and start behaving with more anger. And then institutions trust people less. And that's where we are right now. I think we're in this kind of vicious circle where people trust institutions less, institutions trust people less. And the intervention point has to be institutions trusting people. There are ways of creating the opportunity for people to contribute meaningfully and to contract with them very clearly such that the power is understood and that the power is shared. These sorts of dynamics are all really crucial and they have proven consequence. In one of my favourite examples, actually in Reykjavik, in Iceland, there's a platform called Better Reykjavik where anyone can propose ideas for how the city could be better voted down, voted. And the City Council has a special session to discuss the best ideas on a regular basis. And trust in the administration has risen dramatically. So these that there are ways of structuring these things and that that I think is the challenge like we need the institutions the people in positions of power and institutions to. To take, not just to defend what they have, defend what we have, not to think that we have the best of all possible worlds and the only option is decline. But to open up and it takes bravery and courage in this moment in time. I'm fully aware of that. But there are proven ways of doing it.

Beatrice Di Caro: Completely. And one thing that really speaks out to me is when you mentioned Zelinski, I think one of the best ways he's communicated to people and brought himself to the level of being a peer to not only Ukraine but to the world, is through his social media. What power the social media have? Do you have, apart from Zelensky, other examples of social media being used as a means for good, as a means for getting people involved and institutions involved as well?

Jon Alexander: Absolutely. I think I mean, I think there are there are loads of tools starting to emerge that actually create really fascinating space in this world. One I'll just talk about and then maybe make a more general underlying point. One of my favourites is something called Polis. Have you seen this? So Polis basically enables it's like a what's called a wiki survey. So what it does is it enables anyone to propose the statements that then respondents polis or agree or disagree with. So you can build up the length of the survey and people can put forward nuances that you don't feel reflected in the existing statements and so on. And what happens as a result of that is that you get you can then kind of draw a map that lets you see where the sort of consensus bubbles are, where the what, where what in conventional social media become echo chambers, where they lie, and where the kind of chasms between all and then with some proper facilitation, you can actually sort of start to identify the statements that lie in the space between where where consensus can be built. This is a tool that's been used all over the world. And in New Zealand it's been used on biodiversity strategy UK. The Cabinet Office has been experimenting with it in Taiwan. I know they've used it in various ways over the last few years, including crowdsourcing a policy framework on regulating Uber, that there are many, many examples of the of the use of this. Now the underlying point I would make is that I think technology is not going to save us. And when I was there right at the beginning of the sharing economy and sort of 2012, 2013, 2014, we were all going, this is going to change the world, and that isn't what happened. Instead of turning every transaction into a relationship, what those platforms have done, I would argue, is turn every relationship into a transaction. We've kind of become consumers of each other through those platforms. But the and that that is because the mindsets from within which we build the tools that shape our society matters. And we what I would argue is a lot of the tools that we've built in recent years and decades have been built from within the consumer frame. The idea that people are self-interested, that everything is a transaction, that that that we're seeking to sort of maximise profits and so on. And as a result, what we've built are tools that then shape us back as consumers. So the philosopher Marshall McLuhan had this phrase First we shape our tools and then our tools shape us. But the the opportunity in this moment is that people are starting to build tools that are built from within the citizen mindset and are built on the basis of enabling collaboration that are built on the basis of generating greater power, not being a kind of an old style kind of currency that you hoard, but something that you channel and build and allow to flow. If we pay attention to these emerging models and these emerging patterns and the value that's being the deep value that's being created there, then we can grow that and step into it.

Beatrice Di Caro: Looking at it from an individual. How do I become more of a citizen? You know, because there is voting. But we've seen this. I'm part Italian. Then there was the biggest rate of abstained is in the latest elections. You know, how can I become more of a citizen? There also is the philosophical question Aren't we all citizens by nature? But how do I become less of a consumer and more of a citizen?

Jon Alexander: Lovely question. I think what we live in today is what I would call a consumer democracy, where where the only agency is to choose between fixed sets of options that are offered to us and where we're encouraged to make that choice on the basis of self-interest. And actually, I while I would say I would deeply encourage people to go out, I understand why people in large numbers aren't doing so if they don't see so few of us see ourselves represented in the options were offered. And so withdrawing all our choice from that space is, is understandable, right? I have three steps to citizenship. The first step is identifying a domain like the space that you want to commit to. What's the space that you want to be part of making better? A space that you feel able to contribute to encourage, to contribute to in some way. The second step. Find the others. Like there are probably people in that community or space working to make it better already. That might be your workplace. It might be the town where you live. It might be an interest group or anything. There may well be people already trying to make it better. Go find them and join them. Or if they don't exist, still find them. But the first step is to put up the bat signal. Go, come forth, come together, and only then decide what to do and decide together. And the power that's unleashed by that. One of the things I found in the research for the book, I was astonished by the number of the most powerful initiatives I found all over the world that started as litter picks. I mean, it sounds really trivial, right? But like there's amazing organisation in Grimsby in northern England, which is by all repute a pretty rundown town. This guy really put up his hand at a meeting and said, But we don't just have another meeting of people complaining. We don't just have to complain. I'm going to go and pick up some litter tomorrow. Who's who's going to come and join me? First time ten people. Two weeks later, 20 people. Grows and grows. Four years on that, what has become an organisation called East Marsh United that has a six monthly arts festival, a fortnightly magazine called The Proud East Motion, and has just closed a half million pound community share offer, which in Grimsby is enough money to buy ten houses, create good local jobs to refit them, and then let them out as a social landlord. Now, that is still relatively small scale, but that's transformational. And the same is true of Kennedy. And they are probably the world's leading social entrepreneur, basically started with a litter pick in in Kibera, the slum of Nairobi, where he grew up like this, this. It's astonishing how much the reason I dwell on that is because it's like the thing you do isn't really the most significant thing. Active. Doing it together is the most significant thing. And litter picks are really great in that way. The the word cities. And actually I discovered one of my favourite little moments in the research. The word citizen literally derives from the Latin, which means together people. And it's just this lovely thing. Citizenship has become turned into this idea of a passport and a status, and that's not what it is. It's an idea of our interdependence, and that's what we need to embrace. I think it's really powerful to contrast that idea of decide on home, find the others, decide together what to do first, that simple three step with what it means, what you have to do to try to be good as a consumer, which is like, never fly, never eat me, never drink, never have a disposable cup, never. And don't get me wrong, all of those things matter. Like we need to do those things. But the folk, what that does as individuals is all of the change. And actually it diminishes our agency because our true agency in the world is only ever together.

Beatrice Di Caro: Of course. Also, I was going to ask, what is a nice message for our audience, a hopeful message for them. But I think that perfectly encapsulates what they can do and is a lovely, hopeful message for them, I think. The younger generation are already doing a lot of the steps you mentioned they're all involved and maybe to end the episode, to branch out and look at what authors inspire you. You know, who do you read? Do you have any recommendations for our audience? Is there maybe an upcoming book you're excited about?

Jon Alexander: There's so many. I'm I'm a particularly huge fan of Kate Rae Worth's work on the concepts of doughnut economics and would highly recommend. I'm a I'm a huge fan of the Turkish writer and activist Jo Temple and her book, How to Lose a Country. And even more so, her book together, which you probably can recognise my affiliation with. And the message of that really is that she has this wonderful thing. She says, like, if you ask me where the hope lies, if you really insist on asking me where I hope lies, then I say follow the young women. And I think that's such a powerful message and maybe one more name to throw in the mix. And then on like my favourite sort of contribution in this moment in time is Rebecca Solnit. It's work I think is wonderful, particularly her book Hope in the Dark, which is a classic, and her definition of hope and that she says she has optimism, is the belief that things will be all right no matter what we do. Pessimism, this belief that things will be rubbish no matter what we do. Both Excuse us from action. And she says hope is different. Hope is hope lies in the in the in the in the spaciousness of uncertainty, I think, is the phrase this is off the top of my head. So if Rebecca listens to this and I get it wrong, then I apologise. But she says so there's hope because clarity plus imagination, the clarity to see the troubles of the world for what they are and the imagination to see that they don't have to be with our action. And so this this focus on the idea of agency runs throughout all of the things I would recommend. But I think that idea that that the future is still up for grabs, but it requires people in positions of power to have some humility and open up. And it requires people sort of more coming up through the through the world to to to take on the agency that they have and and and shape the world together. But it requires that sort of top down, opening up and that bottom that bottom up kind of standing with pride to come together. But it is it is, I still believe, completely possible.

Beatrice Di Caro: That was author John Alexander on his new book, Citizens Why the Key to Fixing Everything is All of us. Big thanks for joining and for listening to the World Economic Forum Book Club podcast. Please subscribe to this podcast and our sister Podcasts, Radio Davos and Meet the leader. And best of all, leave us a review. Don't forget to join our book club on Facebook and our podcast club on Facebook as well. This episode of the Book Club podcast was presented by myself, Beatrice Di Caro. Production was with Gareth Nolan and thanks to our podcast editor Robin Pomeroy. We'll be back soon, but for now. Thanks for listening and goodbye.